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Post by Jangling Jack on Jan 17, 2009 20:52:53 GMT
They unceremoniously dumped him after Who Are You, an album where he obviously had a wanning influence (with ASStley crashing his way in), in favour of Szymczyk for Face Dances, who offered a pretty turgid production value. That seems like quite a slap in the face, given the seminal recordings he'd done with the band.
They then brought him back for It's Hard, but that album (to my ears at least) is far and away from the sound of Who's Next, leading me to conclude that he never had much control in that situation either, despite his producer's credit. I notice that ASStley is credited as 'Executive Producer,' by the way.
And when it came time to record "Real Good Looking Boy" and "Old Red Wine," although they apparently attempt to steal his style (as evidenced by the little documentary on the AJ DVD, "Who's Back"), he himself wasn't approached.
So, do they not get along with the man or has Pete's ego just gotten to the point where he's convinced himself that he was solely responsible for the classic Who sound?
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Post by garethox on Jan 17, 2009 22:41:28 GMT
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Post by Jangling Jack on Jan 17, 2009 22:43:43 GMT
No, I hadn't read that. So Johns was changing his technique. Perhaps that explains the sound of It's Hard
Thanks!
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Post by whosnext71 on Jan 17, 2009 22:44:55 GMT
from what i have read of PTS biography, PT is a egotistical jerk.
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Post by Nnic on Jan 17, 2009 22:48:55 GMT
Yeah, this is an interresting question. In my opinion, Glyn should've always been around. He's a genius. After Keith died, I suppose Pete didn't care at all, just turned to melancholia and started drinking and all that. And Astley being Karen's brother (I think), just jumped on the waggon like "of course they'd let me work for them, i'm Pete's brother in law. You can't go against family", pushing Glyn out and Pete was like "whatever, y'know. Let's just record this real frast, y'know." And maybe Glyn had better things to do.
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Post by Jangling Jack on Jan 17, 2009 22:48:59 GMT
Good ole Rog', what a prick.
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Post by Nnic on Jan 17, 2009 23:01:42 GMT
Well, it kinda seems that Roger drove Glyn off, leaving the hat to Jon. Mistake Rog  . On the other hand I don't know Glyn personally, maybe he is a prick and deserved that punch. But he's still a genius. |
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Post by Nnic on Jan 17, 2009 23:09:57 GMT
"Little, that is, aside from Mr. Reliable, John Entwistle; ever present, ever consistent, he delivered few suprises both in terms of his demeanour and his bass-playing virtuosity. "If there was nothing to do, John would simply replace his bass parts," Astley says. "He'd set up exactly the same sound and say 'OK, run the tape,' and he'd play exactly the same thing. You could A/B between his bass parts over the course of five months and they'd all be exactly the same. Still, at least he was always there, staying on in the evenings to give Roger encouragement when he was singing, and he was just great to have around. It was also the first time he'd written three songs for an album, although that was probably because Pete, quite incredibly, had quite a few songs vetoed by Roger: 'Nah, I can't hear myself singing that.'" I shed a tear when I read this. God, I miss you, John!  |
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Lester Burnham
Loves that CSI tune
It's OK, I wouldn't remember me either.
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Post by Lester Burnham on Jan 17, 2009 23:48:25 GMT
My understanding was that the Who Are You sessions dragged on much longer than planned, and Glyn had another commitment (a Joan Armatrading album) so he had to bow out. And I believe Pete was interested in getting someone new in the producer's chair for Face Dances, and John had been working with Joes Walsh and Vitale, and I believe Bill Szyzyzyzmyk (who had produced The Eagles) was recommended to The Who through the Joes.
I don't view it as a slap in the face to Glyn; bands often want different sounds and want to explore those sounds with new people. Maybe Glyn also had other commitments that prevented him from working on Face Dances, but he made himself available for It's Hard. A producer can't just sit around waiting for a band to "be ready" to record again, and as Glyn wasn't exclusive to The Who, he probably went off and did other things with other bands to pay the bills.
Personally, I wish The Who had worked with Chris Thomas on Face Dances; I thought his work on Pete's Empty Glass was amazing, and might have livened up some of the recordings a bit on Face Dances. Bill's production just made it too sterile and clinical; he may have been fine for The Eagles, but not for The Who!
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Post by garethox on Jan 18, 2009 3:02:01 GMT
"Little, that is, aside from Mr. Reliable, John Entwistle; ever present, ever consistent, he delivered few suprises both in terms of his demeanour and his bass-playing virtuosity. "If there was nothing to do, John would simply replace his bass parts," Astley says. "He'd set up exactly the same sound and say 'OK, run the tape,' and he'd play exactly the same thing. You could A/B between his bass parts over the course of five months and they'd all be exactly the same. Still, at least he was always there, staying on in the evenings to give Roger encouragement when he was singing, and he was just great to have around. It was also the first time he'd written three songs for an album, although that was probably because Pete, quite incredibly, had quite a few songs vetoed by Roger: 'Nah, I can't hear myself singing that.'" I shed a tear when I read this. God, I miss you, John! I know Alex, me too...yet it also paints a picture of a man who perhaps felt he had nothing else - going over the same bass parts for weeks on end, note for note. The man had to play didn't he? Without it he was no-one - only in his eyes perhaps? Was this the curse of his genius? God rest your soul John. |
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Post by garethox on Jan 18, 2009 3:08:35 GMT
from what i have read of PTS biography, PT is a egotistical jerk. Having read it as well, I feel that is a fair enough criticism, PT seems not to know when to stop and often hurts those closest to him. But how many of us , who from the age of 19, had had every word devoured and dissected for meaning would know when to shut up? I often think he just 'thinks out loud' and goes down every path just to see where it will lead him! But also perhaps for devilment too!  |
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who72
Loves that CSI tune
SMASH THAT GUITAR !
Posts: 136
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Post by who72 on Jan 18, 2009 13:58:12 GMT
My understanding was that the Who Are You sessions dragged on much longer than planned, and Glyn had another commitment (a Joan Armatrading album) so he had to bow out. And I believe Pete was interested in getting someone new in the producer's chair for Face Dances, and John had been working with Joes Walsh and Vitale, and I believe Bill Szyzyzyzmyk (who had produced The Eagles) was recommended to The Who through the Joes. I don't view it as a slap in the face to Glyn; bands often want different sounds and want to explore those sounds with new people. Maybe Glyn also had other commitments that prevented him from working on Face Dances, but he made himself available for It's Hard. A producer can't just sit around waiting for a band to "be ready" to record again, and as Glyn wasn't exclusive to The Who, he probably went off and did other things with other bands to pay the bills. Personally, I wish The Who had worked with Chris Thomas on Face Dances; I thought his work on Pete's Empty Glass was amazing, and might have livened up some of the recordings a bit on Face Dances. Bill's production just made it too sterile and clinical; he may have been fine for The Eagles, but not for The Who! Agree 100% , It`s Hard sounds much better than Face Dances which , as you say , is sterile. |
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Post by Jangling Jack on Jan 18, 2009 17:42:30 GMT
Well the article that garet helpfully provided mentioned that Glyn went off to work with Clapton on his Backless album.
As for Jon ASStley, it mentions that he's gone on to work with people like Tori Amos as a producer. Now I like Amos, but the kind of sound she gets is about a billion miles away from what you would want on a Who album.
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Post by flashgordon on Jan 18, 2009 18:01:08 GMT
Well, it kinda seems that Roger drove Glyn off, leaving the hat to Jon. Mistake Rog . On the other hand I don't know Glyn personally, maybe he is a prick and deserved that punch. But he's still a genius. Wasn't this argument about whether strings (e.g. violins) would be on the album? I gather Roger thought the proposed sound was too "smaltzy" for the Who. |
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Post by Jangling Jack on Jan 18, 2009 18:16:08 GMT
Sure. Really doesn't excuse the crotch shot, though. You just don't hit another man in the balls. It's as simple as that.
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Post by garethox on Jan 18, 2009 20:19:05 GMT
Sure. Really doesn't excuse the crotch shot, though. You just don't hit another man in the balls. It's as simple as that. Street Fighter! |
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Post by namsetad on Jan 19, 2009 1:48:51 GMT
Personally, I think the 1971/1972 material Glyn Johns did with the Who is top notch. But I think the sound Glyn got on By Numbers is pretty bland and indistinct (love the album, though). The Who Are You album sonically is an improvement (but still a bit sterile), and It's Hard, with one or two exceptions, sounds awful.
I can't say what influence Glyn had on song selection, arrangements, and so on, but based solely on sonic quality, I think he's batting well under .500 for his work with the Who. Considering too that his best work with the band was also the earliest, and I don't feel too strongly about them reteaming.
Good suggestion a previous poster had regarding Chris Thomas.
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si90
Roadie
Look just below Hiwatt. Cheers!
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Post by si90 on Jan 19, 2009 19:24:26 GMT
Sure. Really doesn't excuse the crotch shot, though. You just don't hit another man in the balls. It's as simple as that. Hi J.J., Just to clarify,"...nutted" means Rog head-butted Glyn. Sounds like it was back to 1965 for a moment or two.Still no excuse for that,mind. Cheers, Si. |
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Post by Jangling Jack on Jan 19, 2009 22:53:19 GMT
Hmmm...Odd term for it.
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Post by namsetad on Jan 19, 2009 23:00:53 GMT
Personally, I think the 1971/1972 material Glyn Johns did with the Who is top notch. But I think the sound Glyn got on By Numbers is pretty bland and indistinct (love the album, though). The Who Are You album sonically is an improvement (but still a bit sterile), and It's Hard, with one or two exceptions, sounds awful. I can't say what influence Glyn had on song selection, arrangements, and so on, but based solely on sonic quality, I think he's batting well under .500 for his work with the Who. Considering too that his best work with the band was also the earliest, and I don't feel too strongly about them reteaming. Good suggestion a previous poster had regarding Chris Thomas. I should add that I also love his work on Rough Mix. |
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Post by boristhearachnid on Jan 19, 2009 23:03:42 GMT
The plural of nut (ie - nuts) means your bollox. However,singular means your head! You are most welcome to todays free guide to the English language! |
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roubaix
Fan
I feel a little like a dying clown.
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Post by roubaix on Feb 2, 2009 16:06:44 GMT
WOW! I'll say - that was REALLY interesting. |
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Post by WhoFanatic on Feb 2, 2009 17:05:08 GMT
^^It was, although the captions under the pictures were horridly WRONG...
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roubaix
Fan
I feel a little like a dying clown.
Posts: 154
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Post by roubaix on Feb 2, 2009 17:38:54 GMT
Probably looked better in the magazine, LOL
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Post by WhoFanatic on Feb 2, 2009 17:48:56 GMT
Well they captioned a backstage shot from 1973 as from 1977 backstage at the BBC to promot Who Are You on Top of the Pops! Another is a live shot from 1975 captioned as The Who live in New York 1977! I mean, not even CLOSE!
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Post by ronmanager on Oct 6, 2014 18:18:41 GMT
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Post by petefan09 on Oct 6, 2014 21:20:31 GMT
Johns supposedly has the multitrack masters for The Who By Numbers, which is why it wasn't remixed for the reissue.
Astley shouldn't be allowed anywhere near a mastering desk. He loves compression. Odds & Sods sounds awful!
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Post by brianinatlanta on Oct 7, 2014 11:40:14 GMT
I forget where I read it but Johns LOATHED the 1990's remix/reissued versions of his Who albums.
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casey
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Post by casey on Oct 14, 2014 13:09:52 GMT
Johns supposedly has the multitrack masters for The Who By Numbers, which is why it wasn't remixed for the reissue. Astley shouldn't be allowed anywhere near a mastering desk. He loves compression. Odds & Sods sounds awful! By Numbers WAS remixed for the reissue, though... I agree that Astley's reputation as a poor mastering engineer is well deserved. His earlier work (Odds and Sods being a PRIME example) is generally pretty lousy. To be fair, he has improved through the years. |
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larry
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Post by larry on Oct 14, 2014 14:51:19 GMT
His work on Live At Leeds, Deluxe Edition, especially the second disc is particularly abominable. That second disc sounds as if it was mastered through a telephone. The sound is cr*p and I never listen to it.
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. On the other hand I don't know Glyn personally, maybe he is a prick and deserved that punch. But he's still a genius.
